Posts by Sea Breeze

35

the sounding of the trumpet

by enoughisenough in

i will risk showing my ignorance but i had some questioning thoughts in my head lately...maybe those more scholarly than me have insight.

jw teach that the anointed who now die go immediately to heaven.

when lazarus had died martha said she knew he would rise on the last day.

You are not ignorant. Understand that Russel had no biblical training whatsoever when he started teaching the bible though the Watchtower. Subsequent leaders and adherents never went to a bible school either. Christians don't have the confusion that we WT educated have.

Man is constituted by three parts. All three are spoken of as YOU in the bible. (soul, body & spirit) Bible writers assume that the reader understands this. When the three parts are joined together, you are alive. When the three parts are separated, you are dead.

Rachel travailed, and she had hard labour. 17And it came to pass, when she was in hard labour, that the midwife said unto her, Fear not; thou shalt have this son also. 18And it came to pass, as her soul was in departing, (for she died) that she called his name Benoni: but his father called him Benjamin. - Gen. 35: 16-18

So, building on this understanding... after a person has died, a resurrection occurs when the soul, body and spirit are joined back together again. Just because a believer goes to heaven (his soul), doesn't mean that a resurrection has occurred. Dead souls (not resurrected spirits) are described in heaven in Rev. 6: 9.

This chart by J. Vernon McGee describes in detail the First and the Second Resurrection. It must be read from left to right.... as if you are standing at a parade and the procession is marching past you. This gives the time sequence.

The key take away is that the "First Resurrection" is in three parts. This is the one that we want. The second resurrection is "unto damnation". That is the one that we don't want.

Everyone who has ever lived will be resurrected at some point, some to a resurrection of life, others to a resurrection of damnation. The chart below may be easier. It can be read from left to right:

First Resurrection (also called the resurrection of the righteous):

1. Jesus as first fruits

2. Believers at the Rapture

3. Tribulation Martyrs along with the OT saints

162

A new generation of anointed that will not pass away.

by Fisherman in

obviously, the older “ anointed ” from 1914 died.

and because they were anointed, they hopefully went to heaven.

in the first century though, a newer generation did not replace the old.

Sea Breeze

DJW,

A bible teacher friend of mine once debated Laurance Krauss. You can listen to the debate here.

Part 2 of the debate is found here.

49

The real story on why The Watchtower society lost a Kingdom hall in Bonham ,Texas.!

by koolaid-man in

jw
friends

what happened in bonham, texas?

: the body of elders and the majority of the congregation decided to leave the watch tower organization.

and with that, they took the kingdom hall.

Sea Breeze

I was scheduled to go to the Quick Build in Bonham but had to work that weekend. One of our elders gave me the low down. Apparently, one of the apostates who had taken over the previous hall was racing his car up and down the street during the quick-build on the road it was on. A little while later all the brothers saw a tow truck pulling the same car down the road after it had apparently crashed.

Supposedly everyone was laughing at how Jehovah took care of the problem. I was told this by an elder. Don't know if anyone else can confirm this or not.

141

My Prediction Regarding New Space Telescope That Will See Back to 100 Million Years From the Big Bang

by Sea Breeze in

a new space telescope launched a few days age that will supposedly be able to see to within 100 million years of the big bang.

wow... only 100 million years from the big bang.

that is pretty early given the 12 billion year age of the universe assigned by scholars who adhere to naturalism.

Sea Breeze

Thanks to the WEBB telescope...we know now that there galaxies are "exploding out of the woodwork" where they are not supposed to be; and that we suspect that "Galaxy formation models may now need a revision".... we should probably look at how we know that stars form on their own in the first place. If secular scientists are wrong about the early universe, could they be wrong about star formation itself?

The storyline goes that gas clouds (3rd generation mind you!) condense due to gravity. But, the weak force of gravity is easily overpowered by the cloud's pressure, as well as its angular momentum. Further, the cloud would have to be more massive than an average star yet orders of magnitude smaller than any known nebulae.

The example below from Astronomy Cast, hosted by Fraser Cain, the founder of Universe Today, sums up stellar evolution problem:

The process by which an interstellar cloud is concentrated until it is held together gravitationally to become a protostar is not known. In quantitative work, it has simply been assumed that the number of atoms per cm3 has somehow increased about a thousand-fold over that in a dense nebula. The two principal factors inhibiting the formation of a protostar are that the gas has a tendency to disperse before the density becomes high enough for self-gravitation to be effective, and that any initial angular momentum would cause excessively rapid rotation as the material contracts. Some mechanism must therefore be provided for gathering the material into a sufficiently small volume that self-gravitation may become effective, and the angular momentum must in some way be removed." Eva Novotny, Introduction to Stellar Atmospheres and Interiors, Oxford University Press.

And here's the admission from Neil deGrasse Tyson in his Death by Black Hole: And Other Cosmic Quandaries, p. 187:

Not all gas clouds in the Milky Way [or any galaxy] can form stars at all times. More often than not, the cloud is confused about what to do next. Actually, [we] astrophysicists are the confused ones here. We know the cloud wants to collapse under its own weight to make one or more stars. But rotation as well as turbulent motion within the cloud work against that fate. So, too, does the ordinary gas pressure you learned about in high-school chemistry class. Galactic magnetic fields also fight collapse: they penetrate the cloud and latch onto any free-roaming charged particles contained therein, restricting the ways in which the cloud will respond to its self-gravity. The scary part is that if none of us knew in advance that stars exist, front line research would offer plenty of convincing reasons for why stars could never form.

I didn't know that science was "scary". God is scary, until you make friends with him through the blood of the covenant.... then you're just part of the family with literally nothing to be afraid of.

Here's a more compelling theory on star formation that better fits the facts:

“You alone are the Lord. You have made the heavens, The heaven of heavens with all their host, The earth and all that is on it, The seas and all that is in them. You give life to all of them and the heavenly host bows down before You,” (Nehemiah 9:6).

“Thus says the Lord, ‘Heaven is My throne and the earth is My footstool. Where then is a house you could build for Me? And where is a place that I may rest? For My hand made all these things, Thus all these things came into being,’ declares the Lord. ‘But to this one I will look, To him who is humble and contrite of spirit, and who trembles at My word'” (Isaiah 66:1-2).

141

My Prediction Regarding New Space Telescope That Will See Back to 100 Million Years From the Big Bang

by Sea Breeze in

a new space telescope launched a few days age that will supposedly be able to see to within 100 million years of the big bang.

wow... only 100 million years from the big bang.

that is pretty early given the 12 billion year age of the universe assigned by scholars who adhere to naturalism.

Sea Breeze

The first long-lived matter particles of any kind were protons and neutrons, which together make up the atomic nucleus. These came into existence around one ten-thousandth of a second after the Big Bang. Before that point, there was really no material in any familiar sense of the word. - Jan 6, 2022

@ Jeffro, the above quote is from a BBC article titled: What Existed Before the Big Bang?

the actual position is that everything was in a dense state that rapidly expanded.

I think that your statement is inaccurate. There really was nothing at some point.... not even space.... and then it ~~exploded~~ rapidly expanded. Or, so the story goes.

141

My Prediction Regarding New Space Telescope That Will See Back to 100 Million Years From the Big Bang

by Sea Breeze in

a new space telescope launched a few days age that will supposedly be able to see to within 100 million years of the big bang.

wow... only 100 million years from the big bang.

that is pretty early given the 12 billion year age of the universe assigned by scholars who adhere to naturalism.

Sea Breeze

@Thomas Moore

Thankfully, they were men and women of science and we now have a glimpse into the origin of the galaxies that we did not have formerly.

Yes, we should all be thankful to men of science. This glimpse better fits a creation model than it does and undirected BB model.

273,000,000 Americans believe in either creationism or some sort of God-Directed evolution. JW's number only around 1M in the USA.

So, this is much more than a JW issue.

Remember:

If the rate of expansion one second after the Big Bang had been smaller by even one part in a hundred thousand million million, it would have recollapsed before it reached its present size. On the other hand, if it had been greater by a part in a million, the universe would have expanded too rapidly for stars and planets to form.

Stephen Hawking

141

My Prediction Regarding New Space Telescope That Will See Back to 100 Million Years From the Big Bang

by Sea Breeze in

a new space telescope launched a few days age that will supposedly be able to see to within 100 million years of the big bang.

wow... only 100 million years from the big bang.

that is pretty early given the 12 billion year age of the universe assigned by scholars who adhere to naturalism.

Sea Breeze

Instead of finding a big mess as the big bang predicts; they will find fully formed stars, spiral galaxies and black holes. I further predict that scholars adhering to the Big Bang model will use words like: surprising, amazing, uncanny, astonishing, and will admit that stars must have formed far earlier than previously thought.

Science.org just published an article that is titled:

Webb Telescope Reveals Unpredicted Bounty of Bright Galaxies in Early Universe

Star formation after the big bang appears much faster than models had forecast

"The James Webb Space Telescope has only been watching the sky for a few weeks, and it has already delivered a startling finding: tens, hundreds, maybe even 1000 times more bright galaxies in the early universe than astronomers anticipated.

“No one was expecting anything like this,” says Michael Boylan-Kolchin of the University of Texas, Austin. “Galaxies are exploding out of the woodwork,” says Rachel Somerville of the Flatiron Institute. Galaxy formation models may now need a revision"

Wow! BB scholars weren't expecting this. But, this was expected by creationists.

I think that my prediction was confirmed.

134

How far do we get away from 1914

by PimoElder in

how far do we get away from 1914 before they have a new light and admit it was all wrong?.

they cling to the old theory of the 77 week prophecy from the wrong date that jerusalem was destroyed .

with the overlapping generations nonsense still we are getting too far away from 1914. what will they say if we get to the 2030s and they still cling to 1914?.

Sea Breeze

The WT declared Christ's return on several occasions. The reason they did this was:

1. so that they could claim that the gentile times had ended and that God's Kingdom now rules. (false premise)

2. They then reason that since the church age is over, so is access to the new covenant "for the forgiveness of sins" (Mt. 26: 27-28)

3. They then further reason that if the above is true, the opportunity to be saved by grace through faith also ended and now it is support of God's Kingdom (which they interpret as themselves) that now saves a person.

Their sequence follows generally accepted timeline events for around 2/3 of evangelicals today. The church age (gentile times) will definitely end one day. The surviving nations after the GT will be allowed to enter based on their works during this time. (how they treated Israel during this time of trouble).

But no one in their right mind would state that Jesus has already returned. The entire doctrinal structure of the WT is based on one premise: The Church Age has ended.

Franz and Knorr hit this theme over and over at the 1958 Intl. Convention in Yankee Stadium. Tapes are available of their talks.

They will never abandon 1914 because their rationale for rejecting the new covenant would disappear. Jesus predicted that some people would try and pull the wool over the eyes of some and commanded us not to fall for it in Mt. 24: 26

Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not. For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. - Jesus

Nobody can say he didn't warn us.

The talk that I linked to above from Knorr, would be a great talk to listen to during the GT. The only problem is that the gentile times have not ended and the new covenant is still available to whosoever.

The apostles were clear that during the church age the Christian message would be a ministry of reconciliation.

2 Cor. 5 - he has committed to us the message of reconciliation. 20 We are therefore Christ’s ambassadors, as though God were making his appeal through us. We implore you on Christ’s behalf: Be reconciled to God. 21 God made him who had no sin to be sin for us, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.

This is the Christian message that is preached during the church age. If anyone preaches a different message during this time..... they are cursed.

Galatians 1:8-9

But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. 9 As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.

WT theology is a sneaky satanic ploy to get people to willingly reject the new covenant so they they are cheated out of the offer that was forged on the cross.

The bottom line is the the ministry of reconciliation was to be preached during the church age. After the rapture, the kingdom message will be the only hope left for earth.

The WT has convinced millions that they are living in a different time period than what they are actually in.

5

Ali Millar

by jonahstourguide in

hi all.. a news article regarding ali millar popped up on abc here in australia.. some of you folks in the uk may have heard of her.. she has released a book entitled 'the last days'.

i guess from the article that her story rings true to anyone aware of the wt religions' modus operandi.. here is the link and i will paste some of the news article.https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-08-09/ali-millar-jehovahs-witnesses-leaving-her-religion-being-shunned/101266998.

ali millar's upbringing in the jehovah's witnesses was traumatic.

Sea Breeze

"We were told as Witnesses that when the end came, worldly people would eat their babies because there'd be so little food … that mobs would roam the streets."

I'd almost forgot about that one. What an incredibly ignorant thing to present to children. It's what happens when uneducated ignorant bible teachers teach others who are also uneducated.

21

Dr. Bart Ehrman Live Webinar Did Jesus Call himself God?

by Diogenesister in

there's a live webinar with dr. ehrman on the subject of the divinity of jesus.

folks will be able to put questions directly to dr. bart, the cost is $14.00 with the webinar covering the following topics:.

• soon after jesus’ death, his disciples claimed that he was god .

Sea Breeze

I know that Ehrman is a self described agnostic leaning atheist. So, he doesn't have a dog in this race. But, even he marginalizes those that would say that the man whom the entire earth counts their years by never existed.

I don’t think there is any doubt that Jesus existed. There are a couple of scholars who’ve argued he didn’t exist. There are a lot of voices out there saying that he didn’t exist. But they’re not by scholars who are actually trained in any historical disciplines. There are voices on the internet. But there are voices on the internet for all sorts of things. Scholars who study this stuff really, there isn’t any, it’s not a question that’s debated among my colleagues. It is not debated. Because the evidence is so overwhelming. - Bart Ehrman